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  • Originally posted by MadGypsy View Post
    boring from a mappers perspective?

    please elaborate.



    E1M1 in CryEngine 3
    Not necessarily remaking a level, my first quake release was to remake deck from UT. However remaking all of quake 1... for quake 1... The tools are quite nice compared to the 90's of course, and the engines are good too, but it's an endeavour that must certainly be difficult to maintain enthusiasm that you might otherwise have for an entirely original project.
    From a gamers perspective? It's awesome, I loved black mesa, I thought it was incredible. But I would have personally struggled to remake everything whilst staying completely faithful, I got quite a bit of criticism for my deck remake (some even said it had been "butchered", this was on the quake facebook page)...

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    • One thing I found was that people tend to just want a 'cleaned up' version of the original. Unfortunately, this isn't very much fun for the dude (or dudet) making the update. Spending a lot of time faithfully recreating someone elses work isn't much reward, and you could argue that if someone just squints at your work and sees someone elses, then what is the point?

      Having said that, it is fun to take an original work and 'What if' it up as far as your brain can take it. All the fanboys though tend to scream and shout and suffer extremes of nerd-rage

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      • Remake Quake was an attempt to do just that - a kind of Black Mesa for Quake.

        It tanked because people didn't like the new stuff in it, and because people weren't paid and there were long absences from the team because of RL issues and all sorts of problems.

        the problem is... if nothing new is added, then why have a remake in the first place?

        It is incredibly boring perhaps not for mappers, but for artists and game designers, to be restricted to making basically a copy of a game, from scratch, with some very slight alterations.

        I left largely because of that. I wanted to incorporate new things, and it was just not wanted/supported. The most common type of complaint was "It's not Quake!"

        Well, if people only want a copy with prettier water and slightly higher resolution, then why bother?
        Scout's Journey
        Rune of Earth Magic

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        • As far as I am concerned, Quake is a game development environment. I doubt Spike, Lord Havoc, R00k, etc keep making their engines more powerful just so one game can never ever change. It's a disservice to the accomplished developers to cry that everything should be 2 colors and consist of 9 polygons.

          The funny thing is, Quake is already a friggin game. Nobody can UNmake it, so what the hell does it matter to anyone if a game is created using the same tech but not the same direction?

          I will never understand this. You would think that "Quake Elders" (lol) would be jumping on the chance to prove their 16 year old game has advanced to a degree where it can compete with modern games as opposed to having an attitude more like:

          "Your game looks really cool and we could use it to amplify that it's roots are in Quake, but then we would have to admit that not-Quake is still Quake. That can never happen cause, well, I really don't have a reason, it's just some made up crap that I followed a zillion years ago and refuse to give up."

          Man with bush drawers - "what are those strange coverings on your legs?"
          other guy - "These are pants."
          bush drawers - "I fear change and will run away now."
          http://www.nextgenquake.com

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          • Thing is, if "purists" want to play Quake on modern hardware... as it was designed, they can! Nothing designed, "improved" or created prevents them from doing that! So yeah, I just don't understand all the sqauking about "it's not Quake blah blah blah"! W... T... F.. 'evah

            Artists, designers, coders and mappers should be encouraged to create cool content, period.
            Name's damage_inc, and killing is my business. Don't worry though, it's nothing personal! Oh wait... maybe it is

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            • Code:
              Artists, designers, coders and mappers should be encouraged to create cool content, period.
              So let it be written. So let it be done.
              http://www.nextgenquake.com

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              • We should spend the next 10 years talking about what we would add/change to Quake so the last ten years of rampant dead projects dont cycle back into the workflow.

                imagine Quake, on a flat island. that's the size of Texas.

                once u define a what to do then u can build obstacles and goals.
                www.quakeone.com/qrack | www.quakeone.com/cax| http://en.twitch.tv/sputnikutah

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                • If I was going to change Quake, I would do the exact same thing Carmack did - make something else.

                  If you try to change me, you will still end up with me in the end, but if you clone me, no matter how accurate you get, it isn't me at all. How cliche' is it for an inventor to claim he will take something existing and make it better? This is done by creating something completely different that can at least provide the same functionality.

                  blah, it's just the complex way of saying what gb already said.. What's the point in remaking the same thing?
                  http://www.nextgenquake.com

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                  • by now, compared to today's standards (2013), one could compare Quake to
                    [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oXkdniNs7as]Gauntlet (Atari 2600) - YouTube[/ame]

                    Quake has a niche, it doesnt have to be q3/d3/q4 etc...


                    remake isnt modernizing, its a continued story....
                    www.quakeone.com/qrack | www.quakeone.com/cax| http://en.twitch.tv/sputnikutah

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                    • "We should spend the next 10 years... "

                      I have a theory, we are not going to have to think about such things in ten years, as PC's will probably be phased out. I think that the "monopolized content controllers" now see PC's as to powerful and a dumbing down is about to occur.

                      Hence Win 8 resembling a freakin' smart phone interface. Combine that with all the "cloud" computing and well, you can kinda see where it's going. Just buy and consume our(RIAA/MPAA/STEAM/EA/etc etc) wares over and over and over...

                      As it stands now, from when I first started using the web, it has simply become almost the next "TV". The main thing that chews up most bandwidth is streaming music and movies followed with the force feeding of ads at every turn. Sad really.

                      We'll see, it's just a theory though.
                      Name's damage_inc, and killing is my business. Don't worry though, it's nothing personal! Oh wait... maybe it is

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                      • I always liked Carmack's idea of revisiting Quake. Make the levels into complete Gothic cathedrals to Cthulhu and all the monsters 'Lovecrafted up' - it would be awesome.

                        I imagine that JC would be kind of awkward about us pursuing it though.

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                        • remake isnt modernizing, its a continued story....
                          I agree, but it seems like (according to gb) that people aren't willing to accept that a continuation of the story can contain plenty of things that weren't available in the original.

                          --
                          @damage - woah, we are very much on the same page. It's almost scary.
                          --

                          We'll see, it's just a theory though.
                          Nah, I think we are past the point of what you are saying being a theory. I will fall back on what Baker said in a recent thread, in reply to me (in spirit). You can't even conceive the full evolution that will take place.

                          it has simply become almost the next "TV"
                          I know, and I got rid of the last version of TV. May not be long before I get rid of this version if I can't learn to stop being distracted by it. Although I am talking more about a computer with internet access, as computers without it help me bring my ideas to life.

                          I imagine that JC would be kind of awkward about us pursuing it though.
                          Hunh? What does Jesus have to do with it? I guess you could pray and ask him since you seem concerned.










                          lol
                          Last edited by MadGypsy; 05-05-2013, 07:51 AM.
                          http://www.nextgenquake.com

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                          • To All Quakers, I would assume that in the ability to 'perform miracles' one JC is pretty much indistinguishable from the other

                            Although I have the same faith that I have always had in JC to pull off miracles, I am sadly leaning towards the other JC now as being more able to pull off a decent game than the former.

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                            • I'm confused..

                              Are you saying that you have lost faith in Carmack, or you're pretty sure if Jesus made a game it would suck?

                              also..indistinguishable means you can't tell them apart..you're going to hell, bro. (LMAO)

                              ps> I just re-read that...err I'm not laughing that you're going to hell. I'm just laughing.
                              http://www.nextgenquake.com

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                              • I've never been a big believer in JC, but my faith in JC has never wavered.

                                With the recent revelations about Id and Doom 4, I'm less inclined to believe in Id as a force for gaming goodness.

                                Of course, if you want to see 'Divine Retribution' in action, wait till Capnbubs goes all Samuel L Jackson on our asses for derailing his thread.

                                He'll be all "Do I look like a bitch?" and I'll be all "He made me do it"
                                Last edited by Tea Monster; 05-07-2013, 06:38 AM.

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