Socialist Healthcare is Fundamentally Flawed

[UnendingRequiem]

The US government has in excess of 2 million civilian employees with an average salary of close to $100,000 per year.

Hey they make more than I do. I only make about $6900 a year.

[Baker]

Put it this way: what's seen as kinda moderately wishy-washy right of center in Europe is generally seen as waaaayyyy left in the US, because we both operate on different scales. I'm not commenting on what's right or what's wrong, but I will say that in general political terms the US is probably one of the most right-wing countries in the world right now, and that does influence it's perceptions.

The US compared to Europe is a bit strange as far as how the government works. You can't really compare them or call them equivalent.

Another advantage that Europe has, people that pay attention and have a legitimate understanding of "how things work".

Germany, for instance, understands trade very well.

The US government can't even really be controlled. And the 2 party system virtually assures that all change or reforms is impossible. The two parties in the United States are so entrenched into the political power structure as almost to be accomplices to ineffective and wasteful government.

I sort of have a feel that Obama at one point took a look at the mess and decided to go on vacations and have parties.

Our government hasn't had a budget ... yes, no kidding ... as required by law since 2009! And most people are apathetic and really don't care. $14 trillion in debt? No one cares. This country is very strange.

The lack of planning, attention to detail, concern for the long term health of the system, the concern for effective returns on investment ... none. I'm not sure how a government can run that way. And I think in a few years, the economy will blow up in a way that makes Greece look tiny.

Oh well!

[metchsteekle]

[AAA]

well, i used to know somebody here in Canada, once was a friend, sorta... these days he is the proud owner of 7 assholes...
anyways when he was at the hospital, with one of my current friends, he said to the nurses treating him, "i make 30,000 dollars a month, u have to treat me and make it good, because i am rich"... Ya, go fig.....

Well I tell you what mang. If you'r friend is making 30G's a month WTF is he doing in a GOV hospital? I just had back surgery on MARCH 16, I wasn't gonna wait a year and a half to get a bed at the hospital, I went to a privet surgical clinic that's more high tech then any hospital and the room I stayed in tripping on DEMEROL ( I was high as fuck, no wonder M.J loved that stuff ) was like a hotel I had LCD TV and the nurses were beautiful, some of the nicest girls I ever seen in my life. So I was sitting there, every 4 hours they come check my vitals because of the drugs and then I guess there was a shift change then I could not make out a face in the dark (she had dark skin) and when she turned on the side lamp I went WoW, I was shocked, she asked whats wrong? I said " Your beautiful", she blushed, her face and that moment will haunt me forever. So that's my treatment like M.J. some 45G's later. The week after a hockey player from the Vancouver Canucks was do to stay in the same room I was in.

[StatiC]

"i make 30,000 dollars a month, u have to treat me and make it good, because i am rich"...

cmon man... i BET u can guess who said it !!!
only one person in the world is capable of saying such bs...

[AAA]

cmon man... i BET u can guess who said it !!!
only one person in the world is capable of saying such bs...

LoL! I thought it was him. Did he really say that? My surgery did cost just under $45000 tho.

[AAA]

I'm about to [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dR9GRK9vrlU]YouTube - Ludacris "Blueberry Yum Yum"[/ame] cause my back fucking kills.

[StatiC]

i just did!...[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DBOMqCW5wLU]YouTube - The Goats - Wake n Bake[/ame]
cause thats what i does !

[golden_boy]

If you dont work then you dont get any medical benefits.

Why?

If you want to have better things in life then make your life better and make more money.

Life in the US sure is simple huh. I bet there are truckloads of people who work and still can't afford a private clinic. How come?

If you are not a citizen of this country then they should let you die on the hospital steps

I'll be sure to remember that, my American friend.

I believe that's against the Hippocratic oath. Those old Greeks were some hardcore commies, huh.

I will prescribe regimens for the good of my patients according to my ability and my judgment and never do harm to anyone.

[gdiddy62]

We have highways, police departments, fire departments as socialist programs, so why not healthcare? I agree that the government could screw up a sweet deal even with instructions, but healthcare should be a right and not a privilege for those that can afford the bloated costs IMO. My grandmother who worked hard all of her life is living in fear due to medicare costs going so high and the costs of her medications whittling away at her fixed income. This I do not agree with.
I recently had a kidney stone and had to have minor surgery that require me to stay in the hospital no more than 3 1/2 hours total. The costs topped $21,000. This is ridiculous IMO. Even with good insurance my out of pocket expenses took me over a year to pay off with monthly payments that were quite high. We can't just sit on our behinds and ignore this until it spireven more out of control.
My two cents.
Regards

[golden_boy]

Don't forget that if you let "working poor" die on the hospital steps, you will have to let in even more Mexicans to do the work for you.

That pesky need for healthy workforce. Your companies need workers just as much as they need highways.

(I'm aware of the ethical problem with the idea of "human resource", I'm just dumbing it down for easier understanding.)

[dfsp_spirit]

I live in Germany and I don't see how the "socialist" health care system failed here, hehe.

Are you working for some private health insurance company?

[Mindf!3ldzX]

where some people see horrible failure, others see unquestionable winning!

I see near $4 a gallon on 87, and think it can't get any worse... While I think thats fucking ridiculous,im sure others are like WOW cheap!! Shit works here,shit breaks there. Thats the way things work, when you think you've figured it out, a new problem arises.

[Baker]

The problem with the two party system in the United States is that each side comes up with idiot propaganda to derail constructive conversation.

The word "socialist" means nothing and doesn't have anything to do with healthcare.

The idea of exploring health care solutions in the United States is a worthy goal. And that isn't the problem.

The problem in the United States is:

1. The two party encourage a sensationalist and polarized conflict among "left" and "right" voters to ensure it devolves into mindless bickering.

Case in point: Recently the "right" publicized the presidential limo is exempt from "green energy vehicle" mandates, portraying it as Obama hypocrisy. The presidential limo is like a tank with 5 inch armor. But logic need not enter the equation in political mudslinging.

2. Our news never focuses on actual problems, does some American Idol crap or what some celebrity like Lindsay Lohan or Charlie Sheen is doing. And we call it news. When they do political news, they just spout out whatever the Democratic Party or Republican Party talking points are.

So we have a very distracted voter base with no real sense of what is going on in general.

And our government is run in an equally unprofessional manner, never making any difficult choices for the future and always passing the buck.

So you get things like how in March the US government debt grew $1 trillion more dollars. Or how the trade deficit is like $200 billion per month. Or like how we are still in Afghanistan for some reason (why?).

And when the government does something itself, it is always ridiculously stupid and expensive. Like the TSA at airports and the patdowns, etc. We probably pay $120 billion/year in "Homeland Security", most of which is probably wasted. Our government is so deep into special interest group influence that it is pervasive and possibly corrupted, in both parties.

Anyway, I'm probably done commenting on this, I really dislike how our two party system always uses "smear tactics" on the other party to devolve reasoned conversation into things like arguing about the word "socialist".

We deserve a better political system than that, but we aren't going to get such a thing any time soon.

[gdiddy62]

Well stated Baker. We wonder why so many voters are apathetic, the answer is the politicians themselves and the mindless bickering you mention. I hate election time because of that. No solutions only mud-slinging.