The "Is it Abandonware" thread

[Cobalt]

To me this entire SOPA is more like a suicide note or a desperate cry for help. Unless the ' artists ' who developed the game (or music or whatever media is in question of violation) have specificly instructed it be removed or taken off a site, they have to realize its got a publicity value that could and usually does work to their advantage most the time. If we were able to track legitimate interests to the original works of the artists through the illegal postings of the content, the numbers probably would be astonishing. Theres an old saying that any publicity can be good publicity. As for this game, whats the problem of someone trying to contact these people, they are still around, and the worse they can do is no....do not post the game or mention it here or whatever.

[MH]

To me this entire SOPA is more like a suicide note or a desperate cry for help. Unless the ' artists ' who developed the game (or music or whatever media is in question of violation) have specificly instructed it be removed or taken off a site, they have to realize its got a publicity value that could and usually does work to their advantage most the time. If we were able to track legitimate interests to the original works of the artists through the illegal postings of the content, the numbers probably would be astonishing. Theres an old saying that any publicity can be good publicity. As for this game, whats the problem of someone trying to contact these people, they are still around, and the worse they can do is no....do not post the game or mention it here or whatever.

We've been through this before.

The bottom line is, no matter what one's personal opinion of the matter, if it's illegal it remains illegal and if it can get the site into trouble then it has no place on the site. Personal opinion doesn't count in this discussion.

It's not a case of "if the artists don't explicitly say you can't do it, then it means you can". It's a case of "unless the copyright holders (who may be entirely different people) don't explicitly say that you can, then it means you can't".

[Cobalt]

Not really. You cant speak for every artist out there on the internet, not all will agree with SOPPA. and alot will agree with me on the subject. Not all , but a significant number. The smart artists, the ones with great product, who really are savvy to the effects their work has on their audience can turn around any kind of act of piracy merely by indicating that the work must be great if people are willing to steal to get it. Thats a greater honor than any kind of money can generate. If an artist is in it for pure money, then odd are they are not really focused on putting out a great product anyway. Thats how civilized people would behave towards this. I myself have witnessed lots of ' cease and desist ' type warnings in my trade which others have obeyed...and I myself have used other companies names without their permission, just like the people who have revcieved those warnings did, only I spoke very highly of them, and I was allowed to keep referencing them in that manner, because smart artists and companies know if you have people around you that make you look good, it makes you look good to. The ones who hate everyone, and lawyer up for court immediately, are mopst likely chapter 11 themselves or close to it anyway.

We've been through this before.

[MH]

But the artist's opinion doesn't matter. It may come as a huge surprise, but in 99% of cases the artist doesn't actually have exclusive ownership of the work - publishing companies, distributors and all kinds of other middlemen have large controlling interests, and these people are most definitely not artists.

You can argue "but this" or "but that" or "but the other" round in circles, but it won't be me you're arguing with - it will be a lawyer, and in court, not on an internet forum.

[Baker]

Not really. You cant speak for every artist out there on the internet, not all will agree with SOPPA. and alot will agree with me on the subject

Prove it! Contact them. It is the only way to prove your point.

All it takes is a keyboard to type up a point of view and those are not exactly rare on the internet.

[Cobalt]

Right, thats what I said. In the end, we are talking about someone elses work not our own. Its up to those who actually own the copyright to allow or disallow permission for others to use their work....its usually called an authorization, and believe it or not, usualy, if the entity we are talking about still has al their marbles, you CAN actualy hold a civilized conversation with them before they cruxify you like the guys hanging out on start.bsp , then at least you know where you stand, and the case is closed. However, lots of time, like you see with this game, the people dont seem readily available to ask. It raises a good debate, where if the original group or company that holds the copyright no longer exists / abandonware - and they have not passed the rights onto anyone else, is there a statuate of limitation on the copyright? If no one claims rights to it, the product or idea has to remain like that forever? Any patent lawyers here?

Prove it! Contact them. It is the only way to prove your point.

[Cobalt]

No actually that is right, lots of artists quote: copy each others work, so to speak. But lets face it, it could be a huge undertaking to quote : prove where that originally came from...especially with for example music. Sounds are by definitiion in science as the movement of air....and anyway, Metch already staked a claim -

http://quakeone.com/forums/quake-tal...80-sopa-2.html

But the artist's opinion doesn't matter. It may come as a huge surprise, but in 99% of cases the artist doesn't actually have exclusive ownership of the work - publishing companies, distributors and all kinds of other middlemen have large controlling interests, and these people are most definitely not artists
You can argue "but this" or "but that" or "but the other" round in circles, but it won't be me you're arguing with - it will be a lawyer, and in court, not on an internet forum.

[Baker]

But lets face it, it could be a huge undertaking to quote : prove where that originally came from...especially with for example music. Sounds are by definitiion in science as the movement of air....and anyway

Methinks you have never been in a courtroom. It isn't like TV.

The attorney for the plaintiff submits some documents into evidence. Then after he is done, it's your turn.

It doesn't go down like an internet argument. You either have something to back up your claim or you don't. The judge is not very interested in your speech, just the evidence presented and the law in question.

[Mindf!3ldzX]

To provide you with uplifting hope about Quake being provided for free, on the musical sound track side, Trent Reznor / NiN is already known for releasing music content FREE online for download (one time, The Pirate Bay had a logo for it I think, but I recall them giving one out for free. I'm pretty sure they would play nice and thumbs up the soundtrack being provided for free


However, Quake is sold on Steam. That still makes them money, so providing Quake here at Quakeone.com as as whole "Here,have the free game,instead of buying it at steam".. ...


You should know that equates bad joo joo brah...

[Cobalt]

FWIW, I didnt start this as an entire new topic....whoever moved it here can pickup the discussion on whatever angle it is that made you decide to move it here. I really think I ought to be asked before I am spoofed as if I am making a new topic, but then again, thats the exact thing I was trying to point out in the original discussion, I guess it works both ways.

[Baker]

whoever moved it here can pickup the discussion on whatever angle it is that made you decide to move it here. I really think I ought to be asked before I am spoofed

Maybe I should have put some comment in the topic when I split these posts out of the previous thread, I wasn't intending to trick anyone just move to a side conversation out of the old thread.

I was splitting it out in case someone in that other thread wanted to talk more about Chasm: The Rift.

[golden_boy]

Trent Reznor might not even own the rights to the Quake soundtrack - Zenimax might.

Cobalt; you can not assume per default that it is ok do downolad and share old games until proven otherwise. It works the other way around.

Especially if you want something from the people who made the game, for example their engine and QC source, it is pretty dumb to post a warez link in the same thread, sorry.

I want to contact the devs of that game, and link them to this forum to prove that there is interest. It is not good if they immediately see that their game is being warezed.

Warez links on any forum are usually a stupid idea. It's as simple as that. Arguing otherwise just makes you look like a dork.