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  • #46
    DarkPlaces Q3:A shaders can be up to 2 stages.
    You will find examples here in this forum and of course over at inside3d.
    If you need Q3:A shader documentation in general, please use these for example:
    here and here

    It is correct that you cannot use all Q3:A shaders in DP.
    FTE can use most probably more (because it supports Q3:A).
    Be sure to use more recent DP builds, that supports more than older ones. The "stable" version is over 1 year old already. DP and FTE are actively developed engines (like all other too); so 1 year is a a very long time.


    Originally posted by echos View Post
    It would be nice if there was a proper SDK and documentation for dp so that modders dont stumble around in the dark like this.
    You do not need to stumble around in the dark.
    There is always light for you at inside3d for these specific questions.
    Or read the dpwiki to find uselful informations.

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    • #47
      Originally posted by Seven View Post
      DarkPlaces Q3:A shaders can be up to 2 stages.
      yes but the 2nd stage is only intended as a lightmap stage so you cant layer textures with it, thats why i said single stage. some of the shader keywords don't work in dp, mappers need a list of which ones it supports and which it doesn't if theres not a full implementation. there's enough trial and error to make things work as it is when making shaders that we don't need an additional hurdle of guessing which keywords work or not. for example, i couldn't make rgbgen wave work, how would i know if its a problem in my syntax, or blending mode used, or if its not a keyword recognized by the engine? thats what i meant by stumbling in the dark

      Be sure to use more recent DP builds, that supports more than older ones. The "stable" version is over 1 year old already. DP and FTE are actively developed engines (like all other too); so 1 year is a a very long time.
      I did try the most recent build of darkplaces and it broke my "pretty" dpwater shaders completely, so i went back to the old and stable version. what version would you recommend instead? (and what are the known bugs with it)

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      • #48
        echos, I feel your pain.

        Two things I can recommend in the short term:

        a) get the source code to the version of darkplaces you have, probably using svn. Then use a suitable tool to search the source code for text. This way you could search for your shader keywords in the source code and if you don't find them, that'd tell you something.

        b) Ask Lordhavoc or divverent or even motorsep and other DP modders on IRC directly if what you want to do is supported. The best way to do this is to hang around in #darkplaces or #qc or both.

        And yeah, a lightmap stage doesn't really count.

        c) use qfusion or FTE... depends how far along your map is though.
        Scout's Journey
        Rune of Earth Magic

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        • #49
          I also wanted to ask a bit about lighting for Quake mapping. I already figured out a bit about the different light entities. My current questions are:
          • Is it possible to make a directional spotlight, and which entity would I use for that? I would like to highlight particular spots or other entities (a pedestal with a key on it, or a very dim highlight on a wall where a secret is...)
          • There are these small blue square windows, especially good for wizard or medieval theme. I would like to make the lighting so that it looks like the light is coming out of the window. For example imagine a corridor, only lit through these blue windows. Is it possible to fake the lighting accordingly, so that it looks like the light is coming out of the window, and maybe even highlighting the opposite wall?
          • Intensities. I have no idea what the limits are. What is the brightest value I can give a light, and what is the brightest value I can give to the ambient lighting?
          • What is "light_globe" for? I get something similar to the "light" entity, but with a 2D sprite in the center. Is this simply for development purposes so that I can see exactly where I placed the light, or is there more to it?

          As always, looking forward to your input, thanks.
          Last edited by Mike_Tyson; 08-16-2012, 10:59 AM. Reason: typos
          The more they [computers] know, the slower they get — as opposed to the human mind, which has the opposite property. David W. Hillis

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          • #50
            Originally posted by Mike_Tyson View Post
            Is it possible to make a directional spotlight, and which entity would I use for that? I would like to highlight particular spots or other entities (a pedestal with a key on it, or a very dim highlight on a wall where a secret is...)
            Yes; place your light entity, then place an info_null where you want to point it. Target the light at the info_null.

            Another method only works when you use Bengt Jardrup's tools; give the light a "mangle" key to point it in a direction. "mangle" takes three numbers; pitch yaw roll (without commas in between). pitch is the vertical angle (I *think* 90 is down, and -90 is up, but it might be the other way around). yaw is the horizontal angle, irrelevant (0) if your light points straight down. roll is pretty useless for spotlights and can be 0. I don't remember if pitch yaw roll is the correct order... read the light tool documentation if you use AguirRe's light (or MH's version).

            There are these small blue square windows, especially good for wizard or medieval theme. I would like to make the lighting so that it looks like the light is coming out of the window. For example imagine a corridor, only lit through these blue windows. Is it possible to fake the lighting accordingly, so that it looks like the light is coming out of the window, and maybe even highlighting the opposite wall?
            In Q1, all you can do is use a spotlight pointed away from the window, and a small light to illuminate the window itself. If you use MH's coloured lighting tool, you can give the light a _color value to match the window; the format is _color R G B where each value is between 1 and 0 (1 1 1 would be white).

            Intensities. I have no idea what the limits are. What is the brightest value I can give a light, and what is the brightest value I can give to the ambient lighting?
            As far as I know, lights are clipped at 255. A higher value will just increase the radius of the light, but you can have more control over the falloff distance and formula using the "delay" and "wait" keys with AguirRe's light tool. "delay" is the falloff formula; 1 is standard Quake falloff, 2 is inverse square falloff (which is the actual falloff formula for light sources in the real world). 5 is similar to 2, but with a much larger radius and *clipped*, so delay 5 will never appear as bright as delay 2.

            "wait" basically stretches the light radius; wait 0.5 makes the light reach twice as far (possibly works only in Jardrup's tools). If you build at a bigger scale than standard Quake's, you might want this.

            Ambient light is generally considered to be best used sparingly because it can look flat and remove shadows.

            A good tip is to use a combination of white and coloured lights; white for the impression of brightness (possibly delay 2), and coloured with a larger falloff distance (wait 0.5?) for the colour.

            Coloured lights brighter than ~ 200 can produce discoloured textures, because the light value is multiplied with the texture colour and the clipping of the light value can lead to orange lights producing unnaturally green textures, for example...

            If you want brighter lighting in your maps, you will have to brighten your actual textures in a graphics program; this is because the darkness of Quake's textures is multiplied into your light values. A good way to brighten textures (for example for outdoor areas where you want bright sunlight) is to load the texture into Gimp, switch to RBG mode, apply a new white layer and set the layer mode of that to "soft light". Then use the opacity slider to regulate the amount of brightness. Flatten image, export as PCX, and use Wally to reimport into a WAD file. Roughly. It is very useful to be able to use Gimp or Photoshop when mapping.

            Use light styles sparingly, they can add a lot of atmosphere but impact performance. It is often better to place local minlights in larger rooms (delay 3 or 4, I forget) with a low value such as 40, instead of minlight via worldspawn.

            What is "light_globe" for? I get something similar to the "light" entity, but with a 2D sprite in the center. Is this simply for development purposes so that I can see exactly where I placed the light, or is there more to it?
            The built-in globe sprite is the entire gimmick. It's all there is to it.

            http://www.worldofleveldesign.com/ca...ar-jenssen.php

            This ^ is highly recommended reading, too.
            Last edited by golden_boy; 08-16-2012, 12:39 PM.
            Scout's Journey
            Rune of Earth Magic

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