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  • Feedback needed - Mod

    Well some of you have likely already read that I am planning on doing a mod which merges all of the content from Q1 and it's expansions - weapons and enemies. How it would work is a slight edit to the bsp's. Upon beating "End" you will get teleported to the Start map of Scourge, then you select again, then once you beat Armagon - teleported to startmap of DoE (simple renaming of the levels and map commands do this - infact already done )
    Some of the content I am planning on doing - but would first like to hear what people would like first.

    1) Gibing corpses - very basic

    2) Kickable gibs -> BUT gibs are gone after 5 seconds. They disappear in a mini gib (blood splat and gone). So gib someone - gibs fly and you can interact with them - if one flys at you and you hit it - you send it flying the other way but it will disappear soon after.

    3) QTest/Pre-Release Content - basically alternate versions. Horned Axe Ogre, Nail Ogre, LavaBall Vore, the "Wizard", Vomitus, Explosive Energy Ball Scrag, Dragon and the alternate designs of the Nailgun and SuperNailgun.

    4) Adding in the removed V_Star.mdl weapon from the DoE expansion (check the .pak it's there)

    5) Enforcer gun - kill them they drop it with 5-10 shots. Not gamebreaking as it's weak and only time you get it is first level in ep2-4 - so ammo will run out quickly.

    6) Randomization - this is for enemies BIG thing on this. Basically incorperate the removed enemies into the normal game without having to re-do the maps and would effect other custom maps people made.
    Example: 60% of time normal Ogre, 20% Nail Ogre, 20% Axe Ogre - Leaving out Multi-Grenade Ogre as he should be expansion exclusive. Then with the Zombie - 75% normal 25% Mummy. Vore - 75% Normal, 25% "Wizard", Tarbaby/Spawn - 80% normal, 20% Vomitus ect. Would add a new feel to Quake, also make it different each playthrough and at time could greatly increase the difficulty randomly or make it alot easier (like if all the Ogre's became the Horned Axe Ogre).

    7) ALL weapons can kill everything - Big thing. I'd like it but it will change gameplay slightly.
    Like can kill a Zombie without Explosives. I always found it weird you could gib them when quadded but without not. Basically with Zombies - normal heath, reaches zero they fall. Now when on ground they will get a NEW health amount if they reach zero in that they gib, if it isn't met they get up like normal and have their health reset to normal (like usual). So you CAN kill them with the normal shotty but it will take a fair amount of ammo and can only be done when they are down. So adds a function to do it, but not useful overall as you'd be wasting a fair amount of ammo when 1 Grenade/Rocket will do the job.
    The other is all bosses killable. Chthon can be killed by all weapons BUT explosives do next to nothing and his health amount is very high - Shaft/Thunderbolt does ALOT of damage to him (but you don't have it yet anyways - doing for custom maps). So he will be killable but would basically require you to dump ALL you shots into him that'd you have at that point and even then you'd still have to use the Lightning trap at least once. Shub - will just have insane health - basically require all your ammo - inwhich would be pointless as the telefrag is quick and easy but optional.

    Would also like to hear what other things people would like to see too that isn't listed.

  • #2
    ooppee that sounds great. I would reallly appreciate that and i would like to be a tester if you need any.


    • #3
      Originally posted by grave_digga View Post
      ooppee that sounds great. I would reallly appreciate that and i would like to be a tester if you need any.
      Have you tried Qoetia? It features a few of these ideas with *heavily* commented code, specifically the Blaster, Zombies and Chthon.
      Qoetia B4 == 1.93Mb

      Expo Booth '08
      !AXATAXA! == 355.24 Kb Want to take on Quake with only your axe?
      Hunting shamblers since 1996.


      • #4
        I'd play through Quake SP again for that!

        Lets see some beta!
        Quake One Resurrection
        Great Quake engine

        Qrack 1.60.1 Ubuntu Guide
        Get Qrack 1.60.1 running in Ubuntu!


        • #5
          Hello ooppee,

          may I ask how you want to implement the new monsters ?
          I guess you have to edit the original bsp´s, right ?
          You must define were to spawn them.
          Do you want to let them spawn in addition or in replacement for another monster ?
          If so you must calculate the needed ammo and maybe have to edit the amount of available ammo too.
          (EDITED: I guess you described it in your "Randomization" point)

          The idea with the enforcers gun is really good
          The fact, that it will be only playable in the first maps is only correct, if you use different ammo.
          Or you decide to use the same ammo as one of the other weapons. Then you are able to continue using it.
          Cells would fit best, but you would need to implement more cells ammo into early bsp´s.

          I would leave out gibbing corpses. Imagine how it would look like:
          Quake has no ragdoll system, so corpses would fly through the air like wooden things.
          Even no turning in the air (just like gibs and heads).
          I am not sure if that would look good...

          Killable bosses is hard to calculate.
          How much ammo does a player have left when entering the final fight ?
          You wrote, that they will have "insane health".
          That would mean, you cannot kill him. Cause you dont have "insane ammo" when you reached heavily wounded the final fight.
          So, it is usualy impossible without a respawning area.
          THAT would be a possibility to kill him, even you have only 36 shells and 65 nails along with 7 rockets, when you enter. Always keep that in mind.

          What should be added to your list:
          1.) nails sticking in walls
          2.) DarkPlaces fix for Plasma Gun (due to the fact that LH seems to have different plans)
          Otherwise this weapon is totally useless.



          • #6
            The killable bosses is true yes. I forgot to mention this is mainly for Co-op will work fine for Single Player. The Killable bosses - would highly be killable by using all your ammo.
            Shambler has 600hp
            Armagon has 3450hp
            Dragon boss has 6000hp
            Guardian Boss in DoE has 950hp
            Overlord (first DoE boss) has 1000hp
            Lavaman Sub-Boss in DoE has 1250hp

            So I think a good number for Chthon would be around 4000 - because of the trap. Chthon only has 3hp in reality. Each bolt removes 1hp. So by making his health 4000 - and then making the bolt do 1500 each. So at 2 uses of the trap you've dealt 3000 damage.
            Then you can finish him off other ways:
            SuperShotgun - 5600 damage if all pellets hit and use all ammo
            Nailgun/SuperNailgun - 1800 if all hit
            Rockets/Grenades will do next to nothing - 5x per hit max (so 100 max with all direct hits)
            Shaft - can do 3000 if all hit. You won't have it though. However with Chthon - it will be 6000. So custom maps - you can waste a Chthon with the Thunderbolt lol
            Laser (as it's planned) - 100 max ammo and does 15 damage - 1500 this too will be enhanced to 1.25x damage as it's energy based. So 1875.

            So he will be quite killable. Shub I will but really it will only be doable if you go to the Secret area and get the Quad Damage Killing her will just be for fun - not practical lol


            • #7
              Something up to the community to decide:
              Death messages - currently some monsters don't have any.

              Horned Axe Ogre - Image - He will basically act similar to the current Ogre except runs at the player more and will randomly bring up his shield (for simplicity replace the Grenade Launcher attack with him bringing up the shield)
              Nail Ogre - basically looks the same just different apron.
              LavaBall Vore - Looks like normal vore and all. However in the Pre-Release Quake with the old end.bsp they threw homing fireballs instead. I intend to make it the same except alot less homing but more damage. She will also be recolored slightly (more red)
              the "Wizard" - Image - the skin for this will be similar to a Vore in a robe. Like the Pre-release Vore he fired a Lavaball and launched you backwards if you got close to him.
              Explosive Energy Ball Scrag - Image
              Serpent - Image and skinned (by another) Image
              Dragon (non-boss) - clients.qc already has one for it
              Vomitus - clients.qc already has one for it

              Last one is Chthon needs a message too. Sure "Player" Died is nice but something more to it would be nice.

              The expansions also are missing some:
              Statue Knight
              Statue HellKnight
              Multi-Grenade Ogre
              Hell Spawn (green-spawn from DoE)
              They currently share their message from their id1 counterpart.

              All of the Guardians from DoE also share the same message. So maybe new ones for each too.
              They have a "Egypt" "Greek" "Aztec"
              It's currently "was crushed by a Guardian" for all. I want to keep that for one of them. However the other 2 should get new ones.
              Last edited by LambentHammerBurst; 11-30-2010, 11:40 AM.


              • #8
                Also the expansion weapons need one.
                The official expansions all do, except I don't like how the Multi-Grenade and Rocket use the same "was blasted to bits by"
                I will keep it for the Multi-Rocket but need another for the Multi-Grenade.
                The same goes for the Lava Nailguns - both share the same message "was burned by"
                I will keep it for the normal Nailgun need for the Super.

                So weapon death message ideas please:
                Lava SuperNailgun
                QTest Nailgun
                QTest SuperNailgun
                QTest Grenade Launcher

                Others I may include in the mod as they functioned slightly different.
                QTest Shotgun
                QTest SuperShotgun

                Also of course for than one death message for ALL forms of death would be great too.


                • #9
                  Also the removed Dragon - need a place to put him in the game.

                  E2M5 -
                  His original home - this is a shot of him prior to being removed. However it's a rather small area and only outdoor area. He works here however seems out of place, he just seems to protect the entrance. Nothing of importance.

                  I was thinking instead place him in E3M6 in the area with the Rune:
                  [image][/image] <- Sorry for small image.
                  Basically he will fly around in here. Keep in mind he is quite large (the orig). Mods made him smaller - which I don't want. Then also when you get on the bridge - instead of 2 Fiends spawning - having 2 Serpents spawn instead.
                  The Serpents and Dragon I want to be pre-set enemies instead of random (like the Nail/Axe Ogre's, Lavaball Vore/Wizard Vore) - just because they are a themed enemy. Having them appear in a non-castle level wouldn't work.

                  So placement ideas for the Serpent enemies?

                  I have the ideas I want for the mod, however at the same time having community input makes it alot better. I don't want to just make it to my liking.


                  • #10
                    Hello ooppee,

                    I see that you have a very clear vision of your upcoming mega-mod.
                    It all sounds very interesting and I really looking forward to see it one day.

                    Just found this tut.
                    I know it is very basic, so I guess you are already aware of its content.
                    Just in case...

                    Wishing you all the best for it.


                    • #11
                      Already have the Nail Ogre up and running. Just doing more tweaking.
                      Ideas for death messages and do you think the placement for the QTest dragon is a good idea?


                      • #12
                        I didnt even notice that death messages exist in SP.
                        I thought only in deathmatch mode (as you know I ONLY play Single Player) such messages exist.
                        So for me personally, not an issue.

                        My idea about the dragon:
                        I have read somewhere that in Beta Quake the dragon flies in some levels in the air.
                        Not hurtable, not killable. Just to give a special feeling to the map.
                        I really like this idea. It gives a special mood of beeing watched...
                        So placing the dragon in maps with large outside areas would be great.
                        Killable/Fightable I would only make him in the end map.

                        I am currently working on my mini-mod compilation (including your fix and other tweaks)
                        My wife gave me a last chance in doing it, before I will take a longer break from Quake...



                        • #13
                          A bump
                          Been working on this idea, it of course could just be never completed as I am only half-assed working on it.

                          I do have many of the weapons done. However I figured I'd make the "return" of the Chain-Lightning-Gun. I put return in quotations as the gun itself was planned and even had a sprite (hud) in Q-Test but was never shown.
                          I got it going via Zerstörer's source. However had to edit it quite a bit.
                          After completion though, I'm unsure about it. Like how it functions and all. I have it use 2 ammo per shot currently.
                          1) Too powerful still
                          2) It's honestly TOO similar to the Shaft. Functions the same but just arcs to other enemies, aside from that it's no different.

                          So I have 2 ideas:
                          Tweak it some more with your input. Currently: Slightly faster RoF and uses 2 rounds each. So it eats ammo very quickly. Basically a faster, higher damage Shaft that arcs if it hits a target and eats ammo REALLY quick. (Your ideas for tweaks can be damage adjustments, RoF adjustments and how much ammo per shot).
                          Make it fire slow. Basically like a single lightning strike but this one will instead take 5+ ammo and deal much more damage if it hits a target (and if it hits a target, it will arc to near targets too with equal damage). So heavier damage BUT if it misses it's target - ammo lost and no damage. As it wouldn't be a constant stream - your aim will have to be spot on AND the target would have to be in range (which is equal to the current lightning)


                          • #14
                            I really hope you find the time to finish this idea! It sounds great!


                            • #15
                              I'll just add in that this sounds like a great idea, and I look forward to being able to play it. I'll be sure to keep checking back for updates. Later I am going to reinstall the expansion packs and then perhaps post back with some ideas/suggestions.